-=-
Menu
Tournaments
Profile
Poll
Latest videos
Latest comments
2019-08-23: "Nice work! ..." -GrytmasternCC
2019-08-23: "cc on firefor o..." -Loon
2019-08-23: "oof close one" -Loon
2019-08-21: "ah heres regg..." -Loon
2019-08-21: "gg re" -Loon
2019-08-20: "nice lahm strat..." -ThunDer
2019-08-19: "hyp failed at F..." -ThunDer
2019-08-18: "bg" -ThunDer
2019-08-14: "dayum gurus, ni..." -[GpW]Urbs
2019-08-10: "gg wp ..." -Laro24
2019-08-10: " ..." -[GpW]Urbs
2019-08-10: "pwnd ..." -Plumbe
Latest matches
flag CC [11:02] [GpW]flag
flag CC [05:04] [GpW]flag
flag CC [06:03] [GpW]flag
flag [GpW] [07:00] CCflag
flag [GpW] [05:01] CXflag
flag CX [07:06] [GpW]flag
flag -t3> [05:02] CXflag
flag CX [05:04] -t3>flag
flag -t3> [05:04] [GpW]flag
flag CX [09:02] -t3>flag
Latest forum posts
By: SirEmentaler, in: What JJ2 level title best describes your sex life?JJ2 related 2019-08-21 20:45
I just wanted to say this topic was inspired by a ...
By: Slaz, in: What JJ2 level title best describes your sex life?JJ2 related 2019-08-20 14:13
ELEKTREK PYRAMID :dizzy:
By: PurpleJazz, in: What JJ2 level title best describes your sex life?JJ2 related 2019-08-19 06:44
15 Second Rush
By: Laro24, in: What JJ2 level title best describes your sex life?JJ2 related 2019-08-10 19:15
Nuclear Afterblast :whistling:
By: Plumbe, in: What JJ2 level title best describes your sex life?JJ2 related 2019-08-10 16:50
Wicked Wood :flex:
More...!

JJnet's forum

«Latest posts» «Latest threads» «Search» «User CP»

  Page: 1 2 3 4
     Season 7 proposals | [q] 2012-10-27 12:56
cooba
[si]avatar
JJnet user

Posts: 323
51
1. Ditch the playoffs, they make for a boring season without clanwars. The last legit clanwar was this: http://jazzjackrabbit.net/index.php?league=1&season=1&op=descr&id=2092

2. Do something to the mappool that isn't just a vote.

ty for listening




Jazz 2 Online
http://www.jazz2online.com
Replies
Lithium
aEs
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 1758
107
#1 | [q]2012-10-27 13:13
The ladder season is bad either way with this mentality, but I think it's kinda better with playoffs. Clans WILL rush ladders in both types, but here you must play a clanwar at the end in order to win, while in a season without playoffs people would be like "challenge them? nah, if we win they'll just rush another 10 ladders and reach us again". Something between the two systems would be the best solution IMO.

Also I agree with the mappool thingy, a contest or something could be made.


We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
We ran to the sounds of the thunder.
We danced among the lightning bolts,
and tore the world asunder.
wKtK
avatar

JJnet user
Posts: 707
121
#2 | [q]2012-10-27 13:46
Wild idea here, but maybe make the amounts of points gained per day logarithmic? Let me explain:

Quote:
(maxpoints for season win: ~1000)
First 1-3 ladders per day: 10 points (on win, ofc)
Next 1-2 ladders after that: 7 points
then 4, 2 and then it stops on 1 until a day has passed.


This will reward rushing ladders less, but will still give rewards to ppl who play more.
We would of course need to raise the maxpoints, because ladders would yield more points.

I haven't thought much about this yet, or done any calculations 'n stuff, but this might just work.
Tell me what you think.


Nostalgia warning, well, at least if you're one of those ppl...
(This post has been helpful to 1 of the forumers.)
MasterSven
[CDF]
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 398
41
#3 | [q]2012-10-27 14:07
Nice idea, it would be better per week, because some people can only play in weekends.
wKtK
avatar

JJnet user
Posts: 707
121
#4 | [q]2012-10-27 14:33
Agreed, per week would be even better. This way ppl who have no lif- ehh, have the free time to rush 25 ladders a day will still get more points (like they should, why stick time in something if it doesn't reward you?) but it will feel less unbalanced and unfair.

About the mappool, maybe make a realtime vote with a delay? I could code that in the holiday :p


Nostalgia warning, well, at least if you're one of those ppl...
Vegito
CC
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 398
31
#5 | [q]2012-10-27 22:01
The problem with your suggestion is just like the first 8 matches of a JDC round... The first few matches clans will do EVERYTHING to play vs noobs to gain their 10 points. If you lose one of the first matches during a week it'll matter the most. I wouldn't really touch the system in which you gain points cause now clans "don't care" about their matches.
The playoffs actually give a chance for a couple of clanwars to be played and I doubt there will be more clanwars if a clan can just sprint to a season win like it was previously. The amount of clanwars was not high in the previous seasons either. Is there an award for winning the regular season (excluding the play offs) anyway? That could perhaps give an extra boost.
Iustyn
RDS
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 373
24
#6 | [q]2012-10-27 22:26
what about letting the old ladder system with the clan reaching 100 points and wining but force clans to play cws?sth like "every clan has to play at least 1 clanwar/season else it will loose x points.in this way,clans will be forced to play cw,avoiding the no-cw's season.still there must be some rules or sth cuz in that case all strong clans that wants to win,will try to challenge weak clans for easy wins.
cooba
[si]
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 323
51
#7 | [q]2012-10-28 10:51
Lithium wrote:
in a season without playoffs people would be like "challenge them? nah, if we win they'll just rush another 10 ladders and reach us again".

Vegito wrote:
The playoffs actually give a chance for a couple of clanwars to be played

Without playoffs there was motivation for clanwars to happen, now nobody is bothered to be 1st because there are playoffs anyway. In the old system it was up to each clan to keep up to the game, which made the season more fun to play (and watch lol).

Quote:
what about letting the old ladder system with the clan reaching 100 points and wining but force clans to play cws?

If you were anywhere near the #1 spot you could expect a challenge at anytime. With the new rules (that aren't being enforced because of no CW's, hello!) you get a huge slap on the wrist if you turn down a challenge.


Jazz 2 Online
http://www.jazz2online.com
wKtK
avatar

JJnet user
Posts: 707
121
#8 | [q]2012-10-28 11:47
Vegito wrote:
If you lose one of the first matches during a week it'll matter the most.

Yes, I thought of that. We should only let a clans wins count as played ladders. So 'nubs' who don't win the first match(es) can still try hard for the full 10 points, but stronger clans who try to rush wins will be throttled.

cooba wrote:
Without playoffs there was motivation for clanwars to happen, now nobody is bothered to be 1st because there are playoffs anyway. In the old system it was up to each clan to keep up to the game, which made the season more fun to play (and watch lol).


Completely agreed. The only pro about these playoffs is they make for nice livestream material.


Nostalgia warning, well, at least if you're one of those ppl...
Grytolle
avatar

JJnet admin
Posts: 847
87
#9 | [q]2012-10-28 12:07
Why would normal clanwars be better than play-off clanwars? I haven't really noticed any difference in interest when it comes to clanwars with the new system. Previously, clans might or might not try to make a run for the win at the end by challenging the leader. Now it happens every time. During the regular season, there were never many clanwars...
cooba
[si]
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 323
51
#10 | [q]2012-10-28 12:34
Grytolle wrote:
Why would normal clanwars be better than play-off clanwars?

Because spontaneity > rigid planning, and activity > complacency.
Quote:
Previously, clans might or might not try to make a run for the win at the end by challenging the leader.

"might or might not" is more exciting than "must".


Jazz 2 Online
http://www.jazz2online.com
Kev
-t3>
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 54
6
#11 | [q]2012-10-28 13:02
imo the play-offs are a good idea since u can't win the season by rushing with ladders only.
true, the top4 clans probably wont challenge each other because they are in the play-offs as long as they have their places.
so only clans who are not in the play-offs would try to challenge other clans. (like CDF challenged GPW now!)
but jj2 does not have so many active clans and players anyway. t3, rds, cx, cdf actually, pre was quite active last time too (maybe they keep being active like this emo),
but gpw got and VS is really inactive. i don't think it would really matter much if there are play-offs or not. we dont have many active clans. (still thumbs up for play-offs emo)
maybe we could say that each clan has to play 1 or 2 cw(s) against each other clan during the season, as long as the clans are active ofc.
Vegito
CC
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 398
31
#12 | [q]2012-10-28 13:20
wKtK wrote:
Completely agreed. The only pro about these playoffs is they make for nice livestream material.


Then yes, such point system could work out well emo
Kev
-t3>
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 54
6
#13 | [q]2012-10-28 15:24
or each clan may gain 10p. per week. whatever the number of played matches. so when a clan won 5x, it is done with the ladders of the current week. imo np if the clan plays 100 ladders during the week, when it won its 5x it has to stop, and it has no advantage if it plays 100x and loses only.
if a clan won 4x, has 8p, and makes a tie (+1), it finished the week with 9p.

MasterSven
[CDF]
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 398
41
#14 | [q]2012-10-28 15:34
In this current system it is actually strange if you penalize people who play much, because this is not a real ladder competition, it is more like the JDC, based on activity. A real ladder league is when you face the opponents which are next to you in the rankings (above or below), which means per match clans can gain or lose 1 ranking each match. A competition that would be based on skill is a league where everyone faces eachother the same amount of times. This would make the matches more CW like and will require more time for preparation, as each match would be way more important.

Many people have a different view on what the ladder should be about. If you think it is about skill and not about activity then you should consider playing a different kind of league, instead of penalizing people who play much, because thats what the current league is about.
Owen
*cM*
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 20
4
#15 | [q]2012-10-28 16:46
We can also make two independent games like in football. League and cup. League would be just reaching till some amount of points and cup would just playoffs or group stage + playoffs with clanwars. Later there could be something like super cup, champion of league would face cup winner.
Toni
CC
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 471
36
#16 | [q]2012-10-28 18:16
I asked some years ago someone to make divisions (changeable during the season). The first division would have first 5 ranked teams, and the second one the rest. Clans can play ladders only if they are in the same division. This sucks because there are 5 active clans in total.
KRSplat
avatar

JJnet user
Posts: 189
15
#17 | [q]2012-10-28 20:58
1. You are right, very few clanwars happened since playoffs began. Before playoffs, clanwars happened to obtain highest rank or prevent highest ranked team from winning. Though playoffs provide the same opportunity and are essentialy similar to multiple clanwars. The main difference is that clanwars happen at any time during a season, and playoffs happen after the season before awarding the winner. So the goal would be to encourage clanwars during the season to enhance competition. So I came up with some suggestions to keep playoffs, because it helps to determine strength of teams, yet create larger-scale activity during seasons.

A) Eliminate point loss for losing clanwars. Maybe that would allow someone to make a challenge without risking a lot of points.

B) Generate clanwars, as if they were wild pokemon encounters, for instance clan A playing clan B in ladder, they go to submit and verify. Wild clanwar appears. You can't escape. Teams are randomly forced to play clanwar within 1 week of playing ladder.

2. Familiarity with a level will allow it to be considered for ladder mappool inclusion. So the first step is choosing which level you want to play, and play it with other people to increase its popularity. Finding levels with possibility is simple, we can look at levels from NT, eztrig, Crystalline. And other levels played often like EOTM and Minimal Duel. Personally I suggested already Pinball 2K5 and JAIL. Name levels that you want to be added to mappool. With voting, it allows clanleaders collectively the decision of addition and subtraction. So the next step is convincing your clanleader to make their vote, or being a clanleader and acquiring the points necessary to vote. Other ideas for changing mappool that I can think of.

A) Referendum, allow every player to vote for mappool changes instead of only clanleaders.

B) Contest, create levels specifically to be judged for mappool addition.
Iustyn
RDS
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 373
24
#18 | [q]2012-10-28 21:06
guys i guess u forgot sth
u all say that this season shouldnt be decided by clan's activity but think a little.
do u think that a strong clan but still a clan that doesnt play many ladders should deserve to easily go playoffs and then win?no.if u want to win the season,its ur job to make and win ladders.if ur stronger than all then it doesnt mean u should win.
its like a dance-battle between a strong and talented person and some1 weaker but some1 who works a lot to become strong.as long as the second person worked a lot and did it then gj....u cant just say "no,u won cuz u trained a lot more than me"
hope u understood what i meant xd
King
CX
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 219
35
#19 | [q]2012-10-28 22:42
"just becuz ur strong doesent mean u should win" i disagree with this, but i do see where you're going with this.

i read most of the comments here and as someone already said this wasnt supposed to be about strongest players sipping their coffee and waitin for play-offs, it was supposed to be of active average players playing jj2 a lot and gettin a lot of points then half active strong players like CC to train and challenge them to prevent them from winning. Playoffs are not a bad idea but with having 5 active clans of which CDF and pre are like 20% active u dont need to worry much about getting into top 4 lol. What the hell do we even need ladder system if we all know t3 cx and rds are definitely going to be in top4.


Player: Air!
Air: ?
Krytical
[GpW]
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 90
13
#20 | [q]2012-10-29 15:28
I dont understand .If someone wants to play nonstop ladders is his problem .Why we should intervene and change the rules.Mostly those able to change the ladder system are 18+ (admins) which don't play so much and mostly which play jj2 and the most ladders are under 17.My point is why we should favour those ppl which cant play jj2 ,implicitly ladders, when others keep the community active .If t3 or cx ,even Pre like to play 15 ladders/day it's their problem. For exemple in LoL or Dota or Smite you can play how many fking games do you want and none is against .
Lithium
aEs
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 1758
107
#21 | [q]2012-10-29 15:33
I don't really understand your post, you say that people who can't play as much should be favored but then you say those who do should be favored as well?


We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
We ran to the sounds of the thunder.
We danced among the lightning bolts,
and tore the world asunder.
Krytical
[GpW]
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 90
13
#22 | [q]2012-10-29 15:35
Where did I say that ppl who can't play jj2 as much should be favored?
Lithium
aEs
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 1758
107
#23 | [q]2012-10-29 15:51
Ah, I see, my bad.

However, I cannot see why would a GpWer support that stance, since GpW is only active at the start of the season - just enough to get a spot in the first 4. If the season goes back to the old system, GpW wouldn't have much chance to gain a high place with the current policy.


We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
We ran to the sounds of the thunder.
We danced among the lightning bolts,
and tore the world asunder.
Krytical
[GpW]
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 90
13
#24 | [q]2012-10-29 16:01
So anyway with or without playoffs GpW would be on same spot knowing some players of first 3 clans are active.I don't think without trainings GpW would advance in first 3emo
King
CX
avatar
JJnet user
Posts: 219
35
#25 | [q]2012-10-29 19:47
"the old system" wasnt supposed to be rushing ladders to 100pts. As i have already said it was about preventing the most active clan from getting 100 pts, in which GpW actually could have a chance indeed by challenging the no.1 clan. with players like kenny and kryt (and gryturbz ofc) with a few weeks of training they should be able to pull it off, and the leading clan would had to accept the challenge or lose a lot of points for declining cw's (that was the rule right?). in this system with playoffs there are no cw's because the playoffs ARE the cw's of sort, and getting the first place is not important, so noone really bothers much "as long as im in the top4" is what theyr thinkin. The old system actually lives up the competition trough the whole season not just the last 4 matches. If u find someone to be "nolifing" playing ladders 24/7 u dont have to win the sesaon by playing more ladder than the others, u can simply challenge them for a cw, win a lot of pts and make them lose a lot, especially if its a big difference in ranks (that's how it used to go right?).


Player: Air!
Air: ?
  Page: 1 2 3 4