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By: Splat, in: Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating » Improving rules 2021-06-13 04:00
That just means the rules are flawed; it should de...
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By: MasterSven, in: Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating » Improving rules 2021-06-06 15:18
Yes during stopped games it could be unethically a...
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By: Vivando, in: Royal Families of JJ2 » Off topic 2021-06-06 11:44
Indeed Anubis, was gonna say that :D
By: Vivando, in: Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating » Improving rules 2021-06-06 11:43
True, unexpected breaks during the game can potent...
By: Anubis, in: Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating » Improving rules 2021-06-06 11:30
I did have it open to look at the chat after some ...
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Typically all game streams have a delay of several...
By: Splat, in: Royal Families of JJ2 » Off topic 2021-06-06 02:22
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By: Splat, in: Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating » Improving rules 2021-06-06 01:11
Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating.....
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     Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating | [q] 2021-06-06 01:11
Splat
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JJnet user

Posts: 34
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Watching broadcasts while playing CW is cheating...

It was brought to my attention that some player(s?) had the broadcast open of the recent T3 vs CC game while participating...

Although I'm not a participant in ladder anymore and therefore it technically doesn't make a difference to me, being that I made the contribution of commenting for the broadcast, I will share my opinion that it's definitely cheating to watch the broadcast while playing. It makes me wonder if ladder is really meant to be a fair contest, or is it just attention seeking? This unruliness personally alienates me from being a fan of JJnet, and furthermore I don't want to contribute to a fraudulent game tournament, in the form of commenting, considering that players and teams don't make a genuine all-around effort to play fair. This ladder tournament has to prove that it's capable of consistently providing fair games for players in order for it to earn my respect.

Without pointing any (virtual) fingers at anyone specific, I'm just trying to make it clear that: watching a broadcast while playing is cheating, and I don't want to contribute to anymore fraudulent games that allow blatant cheating, and also that it's really pertainant for this tournament to prove that it's keeping the fairness of games in consideration before it gains anymore respect. Or, either that or just let ladder die(?), it's not doing me any good to spend my time and effort on commenting for a game that just results in players disregarding the fairness of the game.
Replies
Vivando
-t3>
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JJnet admin
Posts: 135
30
#1 | [q]2021-06-06 09:30
Typically all game streams have a delay of several seconds (usually around 10) for the crowd, making it impossible to follow the game situation in real-time. Furthermore, streamers usually set an additional artificial delay for their streams (typically something like 30 seconds) to further nullify any attempts of following the game situation via their stream in order to gain an unfair advantage. I don't know if MS did use any setting like this in the stream in question, but even the stream's base delay does suffice in the case of JJ2's CTF game mode, where the game situation changes completely in a few seconds.

We have not forbidden players from watching their own game's streams in the rules either. There would be no effective way to control or prove this kind of activity anyway. For more details about our anti-cheating policy, see: https://jazzjackrabbit.net/index.php?league=1&season=1&op=articles&articleFunction=showArticle&articleId=55
Anubis
CC
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JJnet user
Posts: 185
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#2 | [q]2021-06-06 11:30
I did have it open to look at the chat after some rounds, or to spectate in rounds where I was not playing. If this is considered an issue I will just wait for the recording next time. Of course, even with a delay set, it can turn into an advantage in certain situations, for example when the game is stopped for a period longer than the delay, you would find out the enemy flagholder's position and health like that. Thanks for broadcasting and bringing the issue up.
Vivando
-t3>
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JJnet admin
Posts: 135
30
#3 | [q]2021-06-06 11:43
True, unexpected breaks during the game can potentially cause a situation where the delay does not apply. Minor, but crucial advantages could be gained in certain situations, depending on what the streamer's spectator targets are and what the commentators are commenting on, potentially revealing details like player health or exact location. In situations like that it could be potentially unethical to peek at the stream while playing the same game simultaneously. But indeed, sometimes the intentions aren't evil and one can be just curious to see how is the stream quality or is the stream crowd cheering for you, etc. These situations aren't always crystal clear and like I said, it would be impossible to control or prove anyone guilty, unless they explicitly confess such activity.
(This post has been helpful to 1 of the forumers.)
MasterSven
[CDF]
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JJnet user
Posts: 411
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#4 | [q]2021-06-06 15:18
Yes during stopped games it could be unethically abused to some degree. Same however goes for people who 'CTO' (and rejoin as spectators), which is not possible to verify as well. My stream had about 30 seconds delay which is basically useless for cheating.
In my opinion streams are mostly there for the clanmembers that aren't playing at that time so it would be very unwise to prevent them from watching.
Splat

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JJnet user
Posts: 34
4
#5 | [q]2021-06-13 04:00
That just means the rules are flawed; it should definitely be considered cheating to watch the broadcast while playing. The rules should be designed and enforced through neutral agency. It's discriminatory to prohibit some forms of unfair play while allowing other forms of unfair play, and it's exploition to invite me to comment about a game while teams are abusing the broadcast for cheating. I'm not commenting with the pretense that participating players are listening. There has to be much more strict adherence to fairness of play, and regulations pertaining to the issue, to justify a game being broadcast at all. A fair game being broadcast for viewers is rather discernable from a showmatch being performed like a circus. At the risk of citing extreme terms, those are obviously divergent options regarding the way games are going to be played.